Dangerous Myths YP_Kung Fu - effective marketing at low cost and maintaing response to marketing

Michael: You have an advertisement, you have a call that comes in, you invite them in for an appointment. And then you close them and get them to sign up. Every one of those systems can be improved upon. When you study this Jay Abraham material on marketing, if you can just make a slight improvement on each one of your systems, the Yellow Page advertisements, what the people who pick up the phone and say to the people when they call can be improved one percent, the conversion of getting them to come in for a free consultation can be improved one percent, and the conversion of signing them up can be improved. All these systems can be improved just slightly.

Michael: This is an incredible interview I did with a guy named Robert Jones, who is the owner of three Kung Fu studios. He called me looking for Jay Abraham material and some advice on how he can lower his advertising costs and increase his marketing results. It runs about an hour long. There’s a ton of great information and I think you’ll really enjoy it. I hope so.

Robert: Yes, basically. Let me rephrase. I’ve been teaching for about 13 years. I started 15 years ago.

Michael: Are you trying to gain information to increase Kung Fu teaching practice? Or are you looking to educate yourself?

Robert: Basically to educate. We basically use the same old stuff year round. We have commercials on television and we answer the phone and we have an ad in the Yellow Pages. And each year the Yellow Pages go up 10%, 5%. And when you’re in five or six different phone books and the average ad is $1,100 a month, it gets kind of annoying after a while. So, my main thing is to find different avenues to bring in students and not spend so much money on the traditional forms of advertising.

Robert: It would probably be about—we count advertising as Yellow Pages and television and such, then I would say about $6,500.

Robert: Yes. I have the old problem of employees. You tell them to take the phone number down and …

Robert: … or you ask them for the paper with the phone number and then six months goes by and you collect all the data and you realize that they’ve gotten you half of what they should have. But lately they are filling out forms now with each phone call.

Michael: So, there’s a system you need to put in place that will allow you to track the results from your advertising. And that’s number one. It’s really important. You want to know where you are and the only way you can know where you are is to track it. And you know you could do it. You can tell them you track it or your history buddy. Do you know what I’m saying? You track it and fill this form out or you’re fired. That is important.

You could possibly, and I haven’t seen your advertising, but I would feel confident to say that you could probably change your advertising and possibly double or triple the responses just with a few changes. Now, I don’t know what your Yellow Page ads say or how big they are. I’d have to review them. But it’s something I’d be willing to review for you for free if you’d like. All you have to do is fax it to me.

Robert: I will just email it to you so you can see it in all its color and everything, unless you have a color fax machine.

Michael: That’s a little extra money, isn’t it considered to black and white?

Michael: Well, that’s a good start. We can look at your Yellow Page advertising and see if we can increase the effectiveness of that. Unfortunately, with the Yellow Pages, it’s something that you test, but it takes you a whole year because you pay for a whole year. Once you put it in there, it’s in there for the year, right?

Robert: Yes. And not only that, in my area there are different phone books. So, I’m positive one of them is probably pulling more than the other, but I don’t know which one.

Michael: Sure. And that you can only determine by getting your people to start tracking and correcting the names, addresses and phone numbers of every single call that comes in. That is key. You’re paying big money to get these calls and I’m sure you’re not converting everyone are you?

Robert: I know the stats. I don’t have them with me right now. But, yes, I know how many calls. We’re very good at that.

Robert: Well, I can tell you how many have called us and how many actually made it into the office and how many made it from the office to the floor.

Michael: And all those systems that you have, you do have a system in place. You have advertising, you have a call that comes in, you invite them in for an appointment and then you close them and get them to sign up, right. Every one of those systems can be improved upon, too. And see when you study this Jay Abraham material in marketing, if you can just make a slight improvement on each one of your systems, the Yellow Page advertisements, what the people who pick up the phone and say to the people when they call can be improved one percent, the conversion of getting them to come in for a free consultation of whatever can be improved one percent or two percent, and then the conversion of signing them up can be improved. All these systems can be improved just slightly. And you can have a tremendous geometric improvement in your bottom line, your profits and everything.

Robert: That I do know. Even if you just improve one percent in brining them in, that number translates into a heck of a lot of income.

Michael: That’s right. Do you offer a guarantee with your service like if someone comes and signs up and for any reason the 30 or 60 or 90 days they’re not happy, they can get their money back?

Robert: Yes, I’ve toyed with that and I tried to change it. I’ve done it myself and I have had some of my top guys put it in there. But when we did it and when we didn’t do it, I didn’t notice any increase or decrease. I didn’t see that that was the main reason why they picked it up. And my thought on that was the way I was presenting it or under doing it.

Michael: You’re right. If someone signed up with you and came to you and said, “You know, Robert, I thought this was going to be for me. It’s not. I’ve been doing this a month and I’m really unhappy,” you’d give them their money back, wouldn’t you?

Michael: The difference is you would do it anyway. So, you offer a money back guarantee when it comes down to it. But it’s the way that you present it and it’s called risk reversal. And it’s one of Jay Abraham’s major concepts. Risk reversal is not only if you are absolutely unhappy with this Kung Fu experience in the next 90 days, you just come to me and say Robert I’m unhappy, you don’t have to give me an excuse and you’ll get not only your money back but I’ll pay you $25 just for giving it a try. So, you’ve reversed the risk. Now, you take the risk of loosing $25. And let me tell you, you may have one out of 100 people who do it. But the amount of increased confidence from a potential client will dramatically increase your sales because you’re putting your own butt on the line saying I know my Kung Fu training and experience will absolutely blow you away. And I’m so confident; I’m willing to pay you if you’re unhappy with it. And if you dramatically let your potential clients know about that, that will increase your bottom line, too, just by stating it. And state it in everything. You can state it in your Yellow Page ad. You can state it in the script over the telephone. The whole idea is you want to take any risk away from a potential customer. That’s the only reason they don’t come into your program because they fear they’re going to risk something; they’re going to loose their money. They may not like. Their friends may laugh at them. For whatever reason, you have to eliminate that risk 100%. So, give them no reason not to try your program.

Michael: I doesn’t matter. You could do it when someone calls in. When you take their name. It could be the very first thing you can say. Let’s say, “Robert, thanks for calling. Before we even get into this, I want to explain something about our Kung Fu training. I want you to know that if you like what you hear what I’m about to tell you and if you think this maybe for you and if you end up trying it … I don’t know if you will or not … I want you to know you’re not going to risk anything. So, I want you to know from the very beginning, if you try our program and you get involved for the next 90 days, if you’re unhappy for any reason, you don’t have to pay a dime or you can get your money back.” Or what you could do is have them sign up with the course without putting any up front money down or without paying. Maybe they could just leave you with a credit card on file and within the first 15 days or 30 days of the program, you won’t bill their card and they could just simply not come back. And if they don’t come back you wouldn’t charge their card. You could do it that way. There are all kinds of ways. But you want to let them know from the very beginning because the risk is the only reason why someone wouldn’t do it if they’ve called in and have some level of interest.

Robert: Yes, I see what you’re saying. The money is very strong; it’s more of an after thought. I don’t make a big point of it and say, “Hey, if you’re not happy, come see me and I’ll give you back your money because I don’t want to waste your time and mine.” I don’t make a big deal of it. So, they must not make a big deal of it.

Michael: Right. But letting them know from the beginning doesn’t hurt. I’m just throwing ideas at you. Some maybe good, some may not. So, where else are you spending money? You spend the money on advertising. Where else do you feel like you’re wasting money in the business?

Robert: That would be the main thing right there. We’re conservative on everything else.

Robert: Yes. We have equipment and all sorts of things. Like I said, once we get them out there, we actually do pretty well because most of the people want what we have anyway. It’s not even an effort. It’s kind of nice actually.

Robert: I’m really good at that. I have students up to eight, nine, ten years. As an average, people will last four months at a normal place. And I’ve trained at enough places. I have enough friends that do it. I know that. Even at our slowest place, I’d say our average student would stay for two years. But mostly we have a lot of long timers. We get the first short burst of people that come in and last a week or two, just trying it out; those are normal. But the ones that actually get out on the mat and start participating and such, we do really well, probably better than any of our competition.

Michael: What is a good consistent ongoing student worth to you profit wise per year? Do you have any idea?

Robert: No. After the fifth year, sixth year we don’t charge them that much more because they’re old time students and we kind of start giving them breaks on everything. So, at that point they might worth $800 a year.

Robert: Yes, it is good. The biggest thing is getting them out on the mat. I always tell my guys, once I get them out on the mat; no body can competes with us on that area because we have that licked.

Michael: I’ve just given you a couple of ideas, which I think are pretty important ones. I don’t think you need the Jay Abraham PEQ stuff now that we’ve talked a little bit. I really don’t. The PEQ stuff is more for bigger companies that have—how many employees to you have?

Robert: The one Abraham product I do have is, How to Get From Where You Are to Where You Want To Be. That one is okay. I found some useful tidbits in there. But it wasn’t as great as I though it was going to be.

Michael: Yes, it’s a mass-market type. You can’t get into the nitty-gritty stuff. I’ve got some of his seminars, which will blow you away. Your head will be swimming with ideas, especially since you have an already existing business that you can apply them to. All you need is ideas and examples of things that have worked for other people and other businesses. And the marketing is all transferable not matter what business you’re in. Obviously, you’re calling because you want more ideas on how to increase your conversion.

Robert: Yes. And also just different means to get people to my door besides the traditional call me or see my sign or see the ad and come in. I want different ways to get my message out.

Michael: I recommend a couple of things. I’ve got a pre-owned course by a guy named Dan Kennedy. Have you heard of Dan Kennedy?

Michael: It’s his Magnetic Marketing Course. He’s a master at generating leads. That Magnetic Marketing Course was his number one product. He sold more of that product than anything. And it’s universal because he gives you sales letters and examples of ways to generate those leads and how to attract customers magnetically. That’s why they call it Magnetic Marketing and really quite effortlessly and how to convert and how to capture them. There are several different products I can set you up with that will give you a good education. When people call me, that’s what I try to do. I try to find out a little bit about what they’re doing and I kind of customize a package. Maybe not with just Dan Kennedy, but with some Jay Abraham stuff, too. If the only exposure you’ve had is with that book from Jay Abraham, I’ve got some other great material that I’m sure can help you. But I don’t want to give you stuff that’s going to overlap each other.

Michael: Let me ask you this. Are you willing to invest $300, $400 in some material if I put together a custom package? And like I talked about the guarantee, I’ll take the risk away from you 100%. If you are at any time unhappy with it or you don’t think it’s a good value, I’ll give you all your money back plus I’ll pay you $25 just for trying.

Robert: No, I can’t do that yet. I have to do that when I get to work. I’ll do that a little bit later today.

Michael: Let me put a custom package together for you and then I’ll email you back what it is and how I think and why I think you’ll benefit from it. I don’t want to load you up with so much stuff because it does take some time to study the material. But I think I’ll give you some power stuff that at least you can start out with.

Michael: Email me the Yellow Page ad and give me a couple of days. I’ll customize a package specifically for you. I have some specific stuff for your specific industry already in place for you that I think you’ll really like.

Robert: That’ll be great. I’ll probably have some more questions, so if you don’t mind, I’ll write them down and maybe fax them to you or email them to you with my Yellow Page ad.

Michael: Yes. Put them in your email. So, let’s plan on a $300 package plus shipping is only going to be about $10. So, it will be a good place to start. Email me your ad. Email me all the questions you can think of. I’ll call you back. We’ll record it and I’ll answer those questions and I’ll review your ad. And then once we do that, I’ll edit the recording. I’ll give you a copy. You can re-listen to it. And then only with your permission maybe we can edit whatever we want out of it and we can share it with others to benefit from.

Michael: You get me an email. Put your name and your shipping address and all that stuff. And then we’ll take care of the credit card or the money details when we talk next.

Robert: You’ll just send that one out to my email address what you already plan to send me so I can take a look at it. And then I can telephone you either tomorrow or Friday.

Michael: I got your ad, your Yellow Page ad. And how long have you been running this ad?

Michael: All right. I’ll give you my opinion on the ad and then what I’ve done. I’ve done a little research, not specifically into Kung Fu. But from what I understand and you can correct me, Kung Fu is another martial arts discipline.

Michael: This is my impression and it’s just my impression. Karate seems like it’s more the word karate has a clearer and more precise association with the public than Kung Fu. I would think when people hear karate, they think of the Karate Kid. They have an idea of what it is but don’t really know what it is compared to Kung Fu. What’s your assessment on it? When people call you, what do they ask? Do they ask how is Kung Fu different from karate?

Robert: No. Usually once they call us and they’ve either seen the commercial on the television or they’ve driven by and saw our sign or they just looked it up in the phone book. They just pick one.

Robert: Well, anybody that takes students could be considered competition. So, if you want to look at it that way, yes. Basically karate is a Japanese art. Kung Fu is a Chinese art.

Robert: It attracts a different type of person. Most people that are going to train have done at least some kind of research and kind of realize that.

Robert: Right. And technically you can trace karate back to China, too. The Japanese changed the name.

Michael: When someone came to you and said, “I called this karate studio and I’m thinking about karate and then I wanted to call you guys. Why should I take Robert Kung Fu rather than karate?” What would you say?

Robert: Well, I would say Kung Fu is the grandmother of all martial arts. It is a fact that everything stems from the Shaolin monasteries in China and then branched off. Karate is one section of Kung Fu. It’s not the whole thing but the linear straight-line hard motions, which Kung Fu has but not limited to it. That’s my answer.

Michael: And that’s because Chinese history … how many thousands of years back does it go?

Robert: They say they can trace it back, the first martial arts, to 4000. But really to come up with organized, you’re looking at 1500, 1600 years ago. And it became an actual way of life.

Michael: Let me ask you, why do you think people call your studio? And I’m not saying all people; everyone has different reasons, but give me the top three reasons why someone calls your ad and want to take Kung Fu lessons?

Robert: Somebody opens the phone book and sees somebody kicking somebody in the head or you see somebody flying across—whatever and it doesn’t speak of peace or what most people are looking for that inner peace, that self-confidence discipline. It just looks like somebody is getting hurt and stuff. And since we don’t cater towards kids but all the adults that open that page … and that’s what got me that ad. When I opened it up, I didn’t see somebody getting hit in the head. I didn’t see some crazy thing that I didn’t ever what happen to me. I just saw a nice peaceful temple that can represent the peace of mind and has the spiritual connection there. That has mystery. That’s the reason I called anyway.

Robert: That’s how I go involved actually was going through the phone book and looking at the ads. That’s the one that intrigued me the most.

Michael: Do find that people who come to your studio are all looking for peace or are some of them looking for exercise or some of the looking for self-defense?

Robert: It’s a variety. When you get to the heart of the matter, it’s self-confidence. Somebody wants to loose weight, that’s self-confidence. Learn self-defense, that’s self-confidence. So, the number one reason is they have something in their life that isn’t working for them. And they don’t have any idea what the arts are. They have not a clue. They saw a movie. Somebody said that they trained. Somebody said that they were a black belt. They’ve read all the crap and they decided, well, I think I’ll check it out. And a lot of time the reasons they give are truly not the reasons they start with. They keep one or two really hidden back until they train for a while.

Michael: Right. So, the appeal that got you involved was the peacefulness and the calmness. That was appealing to you. And from what I understand, you’re saying maybe some of the basis on the design of your ad and what you wanted to promote what attracted you.

Michael: And there is nothing wrong with that. That is just one appeal. My opinion of your ad from a guy who has never taken Kung Fu lessons, so, I’m like any other guy looking through the Yellow Pages. And I’m also not comparing it to any other ads because I didn’t open the Yellow Pages. I’m just looking at what you sent me. And this is what is called image advertising. It’s pretty. It really is pretty. But honestly it could be much, much more powerful because it does give an image of peace. You see the temple and it’s good looking and it does capture your eyes. But it doesn’t telegraph the real reason why I should call your temple Kung Fu. Do you know what I’m saying?

Michael: In bid letters you have Temple Kung Fu. Well, Temple Kung Fu is the name of your business. That’s great for you because it’s nice seeing the name of your business in big, bold letters. And it’s appealing seeing your company because I’m the same way. Everyone loves seeing their business and their name in print. But this is a pretty big ad, too, isn’t it?

Michael: This ad could be working five to ten times harder for you with the right message. And what I’m saying is in creating a message or sales message; you want to telegraph the benefits of the bottom line. Like you say, people hide their real reasons; that’s called a hidden benefit. What do you think that hidden benefit, the common hidden benefit of those people who don’t tell you the real reason? Can you give me any idea of what you may image one of those hidden benefits may be of a guy who takes your class but doesn’t tell you?

Robert: Most of the time it’s going to come from basically self-confidence or self-defense. Those are happiness. Women will come in and tell you I want self-defense. Guys aren’t going to tell you they want self-defense because it makes them sound like kind of a wimp. Some of them will. But nine out of ten of them will tell you they want exercise.

Michael: But they really want to be able to kick someone’s ass if they ever had to in a second?

Robert: Basically when it comes down to it, I think all guys are like that. They don’t want to admit it to somebody that is on the other side of the table until they’ve been there for a while. But the thing is, once we get them through with that, then they start seeing really what they can do.

Michael: That’s okay and that’s fine once they get involved. But, we’re concerned with getting them in the door. Getting them to call and getting them signed up. That’s the only purpose of this Yellow Page ad. If a guy is considering some kind of self-defense or martial arts, you don’t know which one, and he’s flipping through the Yellow Pages, you want your ad to sell him on why he should pick up the phone and call you. Boom. Bottom line. Because that’s what the purpose of this ad is. Don’t loose the focus. That’s this ad’s job is to get them to call you. Then once they call you, you’re ad is finished doing its work. Then it’s what you say on the phone when they call. And it goes on and on and on. But that’s what you’re paying $5,000, $6,000 a month for on this ad is to get them to pick up the phone and call your studio rather than any of those other studios.

Michael: And I’m absolutely confident if you even wanted to continue to do Yellow Page advertising you could monopolize that advertising in the Yellow Pages. Now, I went through a lot of my material. There is a copywriter, a guy name John Carlton. Have you ever heard of him?

Michael: He’s a big time copywriter. He’s kind of like the secret weapon. You can’t even hire him. But he’s got some courses on copywriting I’ve studied. He’s been writing for the self-defense market like martial arts type gurus who sell information products where they sell videotapes on how to teach people to do these special self-defense type trainings. So, I went through some of these. I collect successful sales letters. I collect letters and headlines and copy and sales message that are proven seller. And I have a lot of that stuff within the martial arts or karate or self-defense type fields. I went through some of that. I could do this two ways. What I do is I buy and resell information. I rarely take on clients. But I’m sure you’re willing to do the work. I can give you this collection of letters and ads that if you just did a little work and went over them and I educated you a little bit more in creating a Yellow Page ad that you could really do very well with now.

For instance, I’m just going to read you some of the headlines. This is a headline from this guy’s work and here’s one. Just tell me what you think of this. It goes like this, “Every fight is a bam, bam and you’re done. All your fancy fighting skills won’t earn you an extra second against this devastating new natural street fighting system. Why are black belts, boxers, jujitsu wrestlers and especially those silly macho military guys who claim to be so tough scared to death when faced with this amazing simple new fighting secrets?” This is appealing to that guy who wants to be able to kick someone’s ass and learn the skills as fast as possible. Now, this guy has been responsible for selling millions of dollars worth of information products; videotapes on this street fighting system. And it goes into a very long sales letter. It’s probably like a ten or 15 page sales letter. But do you see how that one headlines telegraphs the hidden benefit of what a lot of your people taking your class really secretly want?

Michael: Here’s something that’s ironic. If someone has put together a marketing program, there’s one case that I bought the rights to, which I own. I have an entire course, which was developed for gym memberships—how to get more memberships in your gym. And this guy spent years putting this course together. He put together ads, direct mail sales letters, post cards, little small display ads that you can run in the local newspaper. And a lot of it is all on karate. So, it could all be very easily adapted to what you’re doing. And I’ve pulled up a couple of them and have them already typeset in Microsoft Word, which can be adapted. I’ll just read you a couple of them. And while I read these, think to yourself how you can take this same ad and weave it into your Kung Fu studio, which can easily be done. And these are appeals that he has found to be proven to people who want to take karate. I’ll read you a couple and while I’m reading, you just kind of think about how you can use it toward your business.

Here’s a small one that says—and these are lead generating ads—these are designed to do the same thing that your Yellow Page ad is doing. If you can generate leads and fill your studios up for less money, you may even want to consider getting rid of your Yellow Page ad altogether. Your Yellow Page ad is just one way to fill your studios up. But if you could come up with a way that’s as effective or more effective for less money, you may even want to consider getting rid of the Yellow Page ad. The Yellow Pages isn’t the only way to get business, right?

Michael: There’s multiple ways. These small lead-generating ads may be an effective way to do it very inexpensively. And there’s several ways you can do it. I’m going to read you a couple of them.

Here’s a quick way to loose weight, feel great, learn self-defense and be remarkably healthy in just 30 minutes, three times a week, 100% guaranteed or you pay nothing. Kung Fu can do all that. I’m ad-libbing a little bit. Kung Fu can do all that and more. It’s not just about self-defense and learning a few punches and kicks. Each lesson is designed to give you a compete cardiovascular workout, tradition in self-defense and a fun, family atmosphere. Classes are available for adults, 18-60, call Bob’s Kung Fu studio, 555-1212, for more information. The first 20 callers who mention this ad will get their first lesson, a $20 value, absolutely free.

Here’s another one. Warning do not attend any Kung Fu class until you read this free report. Kung Fu is rapidly becoming one of the most popular forms of martial arts in the country and it’s not surprising. In only a 30-minute session a week, you can loose weight, tone up, look and feel great, have more confidence and be able to defend yourself like never before. And I’m ad-libbing again. But do you see what I’m saying.

Michael: These particular ads, a program, that was designed to be sold to karate studios to increase their marketing skills to get more clients. It’s the same reason you’re calling me. I bought the rights to his course. There was a guy that created a course that was going to market it just to karate studios. It was a marketing course specifically for karate studios to increase their sales. And within that course they provided the karate studio examples of newsletters, of the ads, of direct mail letters—all related to increasing their membership. And the guy who had developed this had used, with permission and had the rights to use a lot of information from this karate course. He had designed the course for gym membership, which really there isn’t much difference in getting more members to a gym or getting more members to a karate studio. It’s basically the same, right.

Michael: You’re just selling in different fields. So, I have the entire course, which was designed for gym memberships. But he had sold with it what’s called a golden Rolodex with all these ads, all these letters, all these newsletters. And tons of this stuff is right up your alley for karate that could easily be converted to your Kung Fu. They are already typed up, written and ready to go. All you have to do is implement them. And they’re going to be a lot more effective than what you have in that Yellow Page ad. It will give you a lot of ideas; it really will.

And then I put together a collection of some of these letters that was written John Carlton that I can include in there. Like here’s the sales letter for the course for karate. It reads, “The big money is not in teaching martial arts, it’s in marketing your martial arts school. And that discovery can change your life and income. My new 17 secret martial arts marketing system can help you generate a constant stream of new students without the gut wrenching pain of cold calling or the humiliation of begging for referrals. And best of all, my amazing new techniques and system can operate on an autopilot so you can work less and make more money.” And it goes into all the benefits in the course. Do you see what I’m saying?

Michael: Here’s something that I pulled up from these guys in Australia. This is pretty exciting. Let me read you this. They are like the Jay Abraham of marketing in Australia. They were putting out a newsletter and I have a compilation of all their newsletters. I went and looked martial arts up and found a great example of this karate studio. Let me read you this. It reads, “Karate ads hits the mark. Why 209 readers responded to one simple ad; 209 responses to one ad. Black belts don’t have to talk like Confucius, just as ads don’t have to be cleaver or amazingly graphic to capture people’s attention and get them to respond. Bob McMinnen of the Australian Karate Academy is testimony to the first statement and his ad is testimony to the second statement. Let me start at the beginning. My first phone conversation with Bob. First you must understand that being a copywriter means getting phone calls from all sorts of people from all sorts of businesses. In November last year, early on Monday morning, I received a call from a black belt, an Australian karate champion, no less. I expected a deep resonant voice that spoke in sensitive, brimming with profound phrases about life. What I heard instead was an urgent voice of a karate coach who needed an ad that would produce 29 people to fill his two courses starting in December. During our first conversation, Bob McMinnen was offering something very special, a karate course that takes you to black belt status in not four years, in not three years, but just 12 months. Bob, of the Australian Karate Academy offered people a black belt in karate in a quarter of the usual time. As you can see, the advertisement isn’t cleaver or graphically catchy. It uses tried and proven layouts. So, what made the ad work? Simplicity and good targeting. Bob identifies his target market as professionals. He was getting more and more doctors, lawyers and accounts in his classes. Therefore the headline needed to reflect that you don’t have to be a macho sporty type to become a black belt. We needed to say that anyone can become a black belt, thus the headline you a black belt in karate.”

So, let me read you this little ad. It’s a huge headline. “You, a black belt in karate. You can be by this time next year with this remarkable teaching method become a black belt. It takes three to four years usually. What you may not realize is that it doesn’t have to take that long. Bob uses the same technique that helped win the Australian and New Zealand Open Championships to teach you how to earn a black belt in just 48 weeks. The Bob McMann secret. His secret is in his unique technique and the intensity of your training. You are taken through a step-by-step with a small group of fellow students. No mixed level classes. You progress fast to a higher standard. How did Arnold Schwarzenegger do it? Big Arnie and Brigette Neilson were trained in weapon skills by Sensei Yamakzi, the very same instructor who trained Bob McMann in karate. Money back guarantee. By the end of this course, Bob McMann guarantees you’ll be fitter, more confident and enjoy a higher self-esteem, as well as possess excellent self-defense skills. Otherwise your investment will be refunded to you in full. That’s the power of the Bob McMann technique.” And it has a picture of him doing a little bit of a karate action. And then it has, “Last chance of 1991 special offer. To be taught by Bob McMann is a privilege in itself. It is an invaluable opportunity to be taught by the master. He will take only a limited number of students and classes are filling up fast. To help you start in this rewarding sport, Bob McMann will provide you with a mouth guard valued up to $85. But you must act now. Call today to secure your place. Call Bob McMann personally on his number. He will be happy to discuss class times with you.”

Sorry about my reading skills. The ad is kind of blurry and I have a hard time reading sometimes. So, this is a little ad that can be run in local papers very inexpensively. And what this is saying is this ad produced 180 inquiries. Now, you can take this same ad and customize it toward yourself by using almost identical words, changing to your name and making it work for what you do, right?

Michael: So, what I can do for you, I can provide you with this material. Just turn it over to you and do you think that would give you some ideas or give you some tools that could fill your classes up?

Michael: There’s no guarantee on anything, but I certainly think that compared to your Yellow Page ad, while it looks nice, it doesn’t give the reasons why someone should call. There are no benefits in there of why someone should call.

Michael: And they’re calling regardless. You’re still getting business from it.

Robert: That’s the reason for the name you see on TV because the number flashes by so fast that you can’t see it. That was an attempt anyway whether it’s working or not.

Robert: It varies between $1,500 and $2,000 a month. We’ve done that for years. And I have had people come in and say they remember the commercial in seventh grade.

Michael: They remember it, but did it get them to come in. Can you see a response when the commercials run on TV that the phone starts ringing?

Robert: Sometimes you can. But my biggest problem with the commercial is that they are very beautiful, nice movement, nice philosophy. They’re not just kick and punch type. But they don’t tell anybody to call. We’re missing out on some things, but I don’t have control over that section.

Michael: How many more students can you take compared to where you are right now?

Michael: How many in numbers, how many more clients do you need to be at 100%? Do you ant to be at 100%?

Robert: Yes, that would max us out and at that point I would be hiring another instructor.

Michael: My suggestion and I know it’s probably scary, I’d scrap the commercials, scrap your Yellow Page advertising next year and focus on a more direct approach. I would take an ad like I just read you and I’d put it on a one-page fax. And I would fax those to professionals in your local market. You can send our a thousand faxes for $60.

Robert: Yes and that’s the reason why we got in touch with each other basically was because I’m looking at my income statements for the past three months. I’m looking at what I’m spending on advertising. Each year the Yellow Pages go up by 5% or more. And I’m looking at the size of our ad. In fact, I know the Yellow Page people send me $200-$300 gift certificates for dinner because I spend so damn much money.

Robert: So, I’d like to ease in on this being new at it and stuff. I have a few other little things that I have to be concerned with. And what we have done up until now has worked up until now.

Michael: You could take your existing 60 students—they’re happy with your service, they like it?

Michael: Have you ever asked them for referrals of any friends that they think may want to do the class?

Robert: Yes. We were just discussing that. Actually we do really well in the referral department. A lot of our students, in fact, over half of them are probably in school. But never do we ask.

Michael: Never do you ask. You could probably eliminate every bit of advertising and fill those 60 spaces with just an active referral system. And I have systems that make it very painless and easy for you do to that.

Robert: That’s along the same lines I was thinking because I know that the students who are with us are more than happy. It just comes across. See, you have to understand a few of the institutes here, the art is supposed to, the way it has been marketed, up until now it’s been shut up don’t tell anybody you train. And I’m trying to overcome that old school philosophy. It’s one of the nastiest competitions I’ve ever run up against.

Robert: Yes, in the realm of business. I’ve been in other businesses and I know a lot of business people. These guys are just nasty. And they’ll take anything that you do and they’ll turn it around. Tell people you’re just after the money. So, you have to watch everything you do because it could be turned against you. And the students come from a very high-minded, low high ground, where they don’t think they should pay for the thing. You go to a health club; you’re expected to pay, right? For the martial arts studio, they think it’s dirty to ask for the money. So, I’m overcoming a lot of prejudice. So, part of it was never grow program, none at all in place. In fact, we used to tell our students not to tell anybody that they trained and where they trained. In self-defense you can understand why. You don’t want to be out there bragging. But for business, that’s just a death knell. So, I’m trying to figure out a growth system.

Michael: Are you maxed out with your time with doing the classes and running the business?

Robert: Yes I do. And this is why I’ve started looking into it because I have a receptionist who accepts you, have lots of time for calling and doing things. I took myself out a little bit. I do all my work in the morning and then I’ll come into the studio and train a few classes. I try to maximize my exposure to the students. This is my project basically right now to take that advertising, redirect it and possibly eliminate it.

Michael: Absolutely. I’m absolutely confident—and it’s not like you have to sell thousands of seats. With one girl on the phone for a month, paying her $7 an hour, you could fill these seats. There’s no double. I would get rid of that Yellow Page advertising. I would get rid of you TV advertising. I think you’re throwing money down the drain. Now, that same money can be used in putting together new systems, a lot less expensive and more targeted and more effective. No doubt in my mind.

Michael: You just have to do it. But it’s scary. Think of all that extra money you’ll have.

Robert: I do. But it is a little bit more. It’s going to be one step at a time for.

Michael: When you understand and master marketing, you can create your sales message to a specific niche type person. You could be Kung Fu for lawyers only. Do you realize we could send out a fax that basically has this appeal that I read to you for Kung Fu for attorneys only and you can target market just attorneys? Are you an attorney that’s ever considered taking martial arts? Do you lack energy? Do you want more confidence? And when you target stuff—if you get a fax and you’re a lawyer, you go I’m a lawyer and yes I have considered that … let me check this out. And if you get them to call without any risks, remember how much we talked about money back guarantee and no risk. Just get them in the door because if they like it, they’re going to stay with you regardless. It doesn’t cost you anything to get them in the door to come to a class.

Robert: If I could get three extra people a week, just three extra people a week per studio, I would be extra than what we do now. I would be flying.

Robert: I would be way busy and I wouldn’t have a lot of time to talk on the phone.

Michael: It’s so doable. And you said you have a girl. What is this girl doing for you, the one working for you?

Michael: Here’s my proposal. If you want to invest $1,000 with me, this is what I’ll do for you. I’ll work with you as a consultant over the next month or two. If you have any ideas or specific stuff you want to bounce off me, you can. I want to provide you with a general good education on marketing. I have Jay Abraham’s boot camp tapes. It’s 28 tapes of Jay Abraham’s main marketing principles. His stuff you can listen to passively, but I want you to start developing a marketing mind-set. And as you learn this stuff a little bit, your confidence in marketing will skyrocket. I really believe it’s a good place to start. And then also I have a course, a very interesting course that is specifically on Yellow Page advertising. It’s four audiotapes and it’s like a booklet. It’s called, Yellow Page Gold, and it’s on Yellow Page advertising. So, if you do want to keep your Yellow Page ad, it will really give you detailed ways to analyze it and look at it and improve it. But not only that, I’ll provide you with the entire course. It’s like a 270-page marketing course that I was telling you I have the rights to. I have it all in a Word file and I’ll send you all the files. It has newsletters that could be used by you to generate new clients. It will give you a wealth of techniques and systems to generate leads and generate new clients for your martial arts business. And I’ll provide you with these sales letters that sold millions of dollars worth of informational products. If you really start getting going, imagine this. Imagine if you put all your instructions in your course on video where you didn’t actually have physically be there doing the classes and you’re able to duplicate yourself …

Robert: We have been thinking about that. In fact, we just actually came out with an exercise program on video.

Robert: It’s going to be six. We just finished one and we’re completing number two right now.

Michael: That’s leverage. That’s why these guys can sell millions of dollars worth of their street fighting techniques because a lot of people don’t have time to go to a studio but they want to learn.

Robert: The nice thing about the one we just did is there’s no Tae Bo or anything. It’s not jumping around. I’d say it more close to Yoga than not. Not Tae Chi but close. And anybody can do it. And the more you do it, the harder they become. You get 20-minutes a day and I’m struggling right now trying to figure out how to get that out. Of course, all of my students bought it because they’re loyal.

Michael: Are you online? On my website I have about 60 hours of consulting. You know, we’re recording this. So, once I edit this and send you a copy and with your approval—I have other consultations with other people who call me about creating information products that you can listen to free right on my website.

Michael: And I have it all on CD Rom. It’s really an incredible marketing education and some great interviews with some really knowledgeable people on marketing. I think you can be an expert in marketing if you do some intense studying in the next few months. You’ll have a whole new level of confidence when it comes to your business. And you’ll see that duplicating yourself is going to give you ultimate leverage. You’re limited by those studios, by the rent you pay and all that stuff.

Robert: I know. I’ve done enough reading and enough research and enough books and everything that I know that. I’m just sometimes—should I do this or shouldn’t I.

Robert: Someone that’s been there, done that can say yes that has a good chance of working as opposed to just … I don’t want to reinvent the wheel is what I’m saying.

Michael: I understand. Certainly the bottom line is getting people in the door, signing up and doing it as inexpensively as possible.

Michael: And I think your Yellow Page ad and your TV advertising are probably one of the most expensive ways you’re going.

Michael: You’re going to a mass market. How many people out of 100 do you think really even are considering karate?

Robert: Not many and this is also what happens and I know this. But you have an ad on television. They look at it. It gets their interest and they say, “Hey, there’s something. I wonder what he does?” And they call their friend Dave up and Dave says yes I train down here at whatever, come on down. I know that happens because when we move into an area, we help everybody out. I’ve even talked to the other martial art studios and they thanked us for our ads because they can’t afford to do them. But it builds an interest in the martial arts. And you’re going to go where you’re familiar.

Michael: Unless you sell them in the commercial and give them ten reasons why they don’t want to go anywhere else but you. So, I think I can certainly help you. I think I can certainly give you the materials that will give you the education. I think I can give you proven, effective advertisements that will generate leads. I’ll give you an entire course that is almost targeted specifically to what you’re doing that will give you these tools. It’s already been done. I don’t have to teach you. I’ve got all the teaching, but it’s must more targeted specifically for what you are doing. I am absolutely confident that you can really save money, fill those studios up in no time with multiple systems. As a matter of fact, once you get going, you’ll have your 60 students and then you’ll have more than you can handle and you’ll probably be forced … and I would encourage you to create your entire course on video. It can be done very inexpensively. You can duplicate yourself.

Robert: I get a lot of information but I don’t have time to attend all seminars. And it’s not my business. I love reading about it and getting them and looking at them. There are tons of seminars I would love to go to if I had the time. But if it’s video stuff, that’s different. I’ll send away for books and videos all the time.

Michael: Sure you will because it all comes down to the fact that people’s lives are busier and busier. There are priorities.

Robert: What even would be interesting now that you … you know how Time Life books does that one book every other month? We could do a tape every other month using kind of their model, a lesson, a 15-minute tape. They train and then the next month it’s on a subscription basis.

Michael: Absolutely. I have—that guy who developed that model, the Book of the Month Club—I have his exact ads and you can model them and almost model them word for word and just change them over to your Kung Fu. I can set you up with all that information. I’m a collector of these ads. The right combinations of words that have been proven are worth millions.

Robert: Yes. I love changing things once they’re going and stuff and seeing how I can get better results. I do that with everything. But I don’t want to sit down from scratch. I knew this all has been done before.

Robert: What material can you get to me say now so that I can get working on this stuff?

Michael: What I can get to you now is the Yellow Page course. I can get you the 28-audiotape boot camp of Jay Abraham. I can put together a real nice package. I’ll get to you the specific karate ads. I can email you instantly in Word files; I’m looking at them right now. I had them all in a zipped file on my computer. I can send you over a zipped file of a lot of specific ads; those ads I was reading to you. I’m looking right here, here’s a newsletter. A lot of the ads you want to get people to call in for a free report.

Michael: And here’s an example of a free report. You could change it over. It’s called, “Veteran police officer martial art expert reveals the personal protection secret that could save your life and the lives of your loved ones. Dear Friend. Karate doesn’t work. That’s right, you heard me. Karate and other traditional martial art systems don’t work in real self-defensive situations. I should know with 25 years of training and six black belts from three different systems. I have witnessed first hand karate shortcomings in real street encounters. Karate doesn’t work because it’s based on tradition. It doesn’t train you for reality in a realistic way. If you’re not training for a real attack, you’re wasting your time. What is the counter assault tactic?” This

is a guy selling a different fighting system. They’re all selling fighting system. But this sales letter, all typed up, could be used to create your own fighting system that you’ve developed through Kung Fu as an information product. You’ll have this all typed up. I’m going to send you the sales letters from John Carlton that has sold millions of dollars worth of other fighting systems. It’s the sales letters that are the moneymakers. Those are the workhorses of the million dollars. That is the force behind the money—the letter, the message. And that message whether it’s in a sales letter or in a fax or in a direct mail letter or on a website or in a voice mail recording or an email, it doesn’t matter. It’s the communication. It’s the words that get their juices going. And you model it just like karate was modeled from Kung Fu. It’s the same thing.

So, you’ll have the basic, the backbone and enough tools to create your specific system that will get people in the door. And also, I won’t write everything for you, but I’ll help you. I’ll critique it. I’ll be a sounding board and be there for you if you need anything.

Robert: That’s the nice part. I do like trying to write the things. I’m into that. If I have a done product, I would really like to have somebody that’s more experienced take a look at it even it’s for four minutes and send it back and say work on your headline.

Michael: Yes. You can pick up the phone and call me any time. I’m here. I’m real responsive with my clients and my customers. That’s what I do. So, I would be glad to do that for you.

So, the details would be you going to come up with some money for me. I think $1,000 is very fair. You know what I’m going to do? I’ll offer you 100% money back guarantee. If you don’t feel like I’ve provided you the products or the service say 60 days from now, I’ll give you every dime back. So, I’ll take away all the risk. And I practice what I preach because if you don’t have any risks, there’s no reason why you wouldn’t do it unless you totally didn’t trust me. But I think I’ve given you enough credibility from the testimonials on my website to me talking to you that I’ll do what I say I’m going to do.

Robert: Okay. Can we split that up in two payments, $500 now and $500 in two weeks?

Michael: I’d be willing to do that. Let’s do that. You can pay me PayPal, Visa, Master Card; whatever you’re comfortable with.

Robert: My PayPal … I must have signed up for it sometime and they won’t let me sign up again and they won’t send me my password. They say I’m already a member. I go through it and I can’t, so I’m stuck. So, what I’ll do is I’ll send you two different emails with half of my credit card number in one and the other half in another. And then you’ll have the card that you can charge the first amount and then in two weeks charge the rest.

Michael: Fine. Just put it in writing. Say, I authorize Mike to run $500 through on my card for marketing consultant, for products we talked about. I have all this. We’re recording this, so you’ll have a document of it. And then just give me an expiration date. I need a street shipping address, which is the same billing address as your card. And I’ll have your email. I think what I’m going to do with the Golden Course; I’m going to put it all on a CD for you. I’m going to burn it to CD so that you don’t have to open files and any of that stuff. You’ll have it all on one CD. Okay?

Michael: The entire course, everything. And I’ll send you the CD. I’ll put all the letters together and send that to you. I’ll send you the tapes. I put together a nice box of goodies for you.

I want to thank you for listening to www.hardtofindseminars.com . If you want to get in touch with any of the people we interview, please contact Michael at www.hardtofindseminars.com by email. You can emailor you can call (858) 274-7851.